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Exodus 22:16-17: "pre-marital sex" = the beginning of marriage?

What part of "He does not bear the sword in vain" do you have trouble comprehending?
I don't think like that.
The testimonies of those who find themselves on death row.
Did they also got change of hearth or some didn't?

Maybe there should be better way to motivate someone to salvation.

Usually mass murderers are successful at ending their own lives before they are even arrested.
I have included not only Hitler/Fauci types, but also "I'm too careless to properly care about safety" guy working at FDI who causes lots of unnecesary death.

Do the research then. It was because of liberal activist judges, that he was able to eventually get set free and he did kill others!
He is irrevelant for topic.


10 out of 10 people die.
And it will happen one day, unless the Lord returns and I am caught up together with those who have died in Christ and meet them in the air.
Indeed, as sinners we come to Christ as the song says, "just as I am".


Not true at all. There is a difference between premature death someone has inflicted on others, and death caused by our decaying bodies, that will occur eventually, unless we are part of the generation who is still faithful to Christ when He returns.

There is a huge difference between execution and death that will one day occur as a result of the sins that we have done. Understand that the passage you pulled that from "the wages of sin is death" is part of a chapter that starts off with the question "Should we continue in sin in order for grace to abound?" Paul was laying out the reason for why we who are now dead to sin should NOT live any longer therein!
Oh, I see it. There was slight misunderstanding. I didn't mean natural death. I mean why Lord doesn't execute you directly after you sin?

If death is natural consequence of sin, then why delay punishment? Any delay would only give you more time to collect sins, therefore you would be even more deserving of death which means there is even less reason to delay punishment.

Only reason for delay is chance for mercy which is asking for special treatment of not applying Lord's law which you can't do since it's going against estopel.

And you can't throw away estopel since without estopel there is no rule of law. There are special favourable rules for special people.

And Lord can't break estopel, otherwise He isn't fair and just. Justice is getting exactly what you deserved. Everyone who does crime A gets exactly punishment for crime A. No less, no more, not something else. EXACTLY.
Also, we can't assume that death has entered into universe because some couple Adam and Eve did ate apple.

Reasons:

1)2nd law of thermodynamics.

Everything thought time loses it's structure. So universe will die and human body would die anyway thanks to 2nd law. It's only matter of time before body repair system would stop working which means body will start to get old. So even without apple humans would die thanks to heat death of universe.

2) Lord said "Now you will surely die". Death is now certain, but it doesn't forbid death before eating apple.

Following sentence is also valid. "Before you could die, but now will certainly die". Lord could say this sentence, but He decided to use less words, so we can't throw away possibility of death.

3) No significant changes of nature

I don't think that after eating apple natural laws did change. Bible says nothing, so it's possibility. Which implies that universe during "Garden times" worked exactly as our own now.

4) What did animals eat? They do need energy source. So what is energy source?

Since only plants (I include algae here) can produce their own energy and animals aren't plants, well animals did eat some energy source.

Death for plants proves existence of death.

5) Human's energy source

What did Adam and Eve eat? What did die in order to provide humans with energy?

6)Paradise

A place of bliss and content which could be only be result of Lord's presence which implies natural world wasn't blissfull and therefore potencially dangerous.
What happened to Adam if he had fallen of cliff?


At best for you, Lord did remove His anti-death protection for humans after eating apple.


And for last, rest of Romans 6 isn't doing you much favour.

Let's consider verse 14:

For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace

Verse can be rewritten keeping same meaning:

For sin is your master, because you are under law, and not under grace.

Logically, I have every NotA replaced with A and opposite.

So invoking law puts you automatically under sin which results in death which is exactly I don't want to be judged by Lord's law.
 
They bore false witness against him. It was an in-justice. That’s why in the Father’s instructions there is a severe penalty for bearing false witness:

Deut 19:16-21
16 If a false witness rises against any man to testify against him of wrongdoing, 17 both the men between whom is the controversy shall stand before the face of YHWH, before the priests and the judges who serve in those days. 18 And the judges shall make inquiry thoroughly, and behold, if the witness is a false witness—he has testified a falsehood against his brother— 19 then you⁺ shall do to him as he thought to have done to his brother, and you shall put away the evil from among you. 20 And those who remain shall hear and fear, and they shall add not to do this evil thing anymore among you. 21 And your eye shall not pity: Life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.
I don't mean to apply penalty of law.

I mean it's OK to treat convict with disrespect? What is spitting on face, but disrespect?

And what is torture, but applied sadism?

Law doesn't have spitting and torture as punishments.
 
So, at the moment judge(s)/jurors declare someone guilty, is it OK to spit in face of convict, torture him?

Did he deserve that?
We have a Bill of Rights here in the USA that protects people from cruel and unusual punishment. The SCOTUS at one time included the death penalty but then later reversed its ruling, sorta like Roe vs Wade got overturned, because it was a bad ruling. However, that did not overturn what the Constitution clearly states, granting protection against things like torture and spitting in the face. That protection was never offered to prisoners in the Communist ruled countries, and reports of abuses in that system are rampant.
 
I don't think like that.
We do. That's why we are called "BIBLICAL Families". It comes straight out of the BIBLE!
Did they also got change of hearth or some didn't?
Some did. Some didn't. Those who did, did so because of the sobering reality of the punishment they were facing.
Maybe there should be better way to motivate someone to salvation.
Yes. Preach the message of the gospel, BEFORE they commit the crime! HOWEVER, it is up to each individual who hears the message to respond. Salvation CANNOT and SHOULD not be forced onto anyone! That is what Roman Catholicism attempted to do, and it went horribly wrong!
I have included not only Hitler/Fauci types, but also "I'm too careless to properly care about safety" guy working at FDI who causes lots of unnecesary death.
Why? An industrial accident does not rise to the level of PREMEDITATED MURDER! Even in the Bible, if an axehead flew off and killed someone, God provided for cities of refuge!
He is irrevelant for topic.
No he is not! Overturning the death penalty led directly to him getting out, because of bleeding heart liberals, who have apparently gotten into your ear!
Oh, I see it. There was slight misunderstanding. I didn't mean natural death. I mean why Lord doesn't execute you directly after you sin?
No the misunderstanding is how you are trying to twist that verse of Scripture.
If death is natural consequence of sin, then why delay punishment? Any delay would only give you more time to collect sins, therefore you would be even more deserving of death which means there is even less reason to delay punishment.
Which is precisely why Paul argues that we should not continue to live in sin! Context matters sir!
Only reason for delay is chance for mercy which is asking for special treatment of not applying Lord's law which you can't do since it's going against estopel.
Criminals have ample opportunity to repent and receive the forgiveness and salvation offered to them through Jesus Christ. Here in the USA, we don't just take the convicted criminal out right after their sentence, and subject them to a firing squad.
And you can't throw away estopel since without estopel there is no rule of law. There are special favourable rules for special people.
That is a term I am completely unfamiliar with.
And Lord can't break estopel, otherwise He isn't fair and just. Justice is getting exactly what you deserved. Everyone who does crime A gets exactly punishment for crime A. No less, no more, not something else. EXACTLY.
Also, we can't assume that death has entered into universe because some couple Adam and Eve did ate apple.
That is why Christ died on the cross sir. He took our punishment. You really need to spend some time reading some of the Pauline epistles!
Reasons:

1)2nd law of thermodynamics.

Everything thought time loses it's structure. So universe will die and human body would die anyway thanks to 2nd law. It's only matter of time before body repair system would stop working which means body will start to get old. So even without apple humans would die thanks to heat death of universe.
Bad logic! The universe has always been upheld by its Creator God! Read Colossians chapter 1.

2) Lord said "Now you will surely die". Death is now certain, but it doesn't forbid death before eating apple.

Following sentence is also valid. "Before you could die, but now will certainly die". Lord could say this sentence, but He decided to use less words, so we can't throw away possibility of death.
No! The sin and disobedience directly led to death. You really need to study your Bible more. Paul lays it out for us in Rom 5, that death came into the world by sin.
3) No significant changes of nature

I don't think that after eating apple natural laws did change. Bible says nothing, so it's possibility. Which implies that universe during "Garden times" worked exactly as our own now.
You have a small god who is incapable of holding the universe together. Your god is not the God of the Universe who created all things by the breath of His mouth.
4) What did animals eat? They do need energy source. So what is energy source?

Since only plants (I include algae here) can produce their own energy and animals aren't plants, well animals did eat some energy source.
Plants. There is no record of animals eating other animals prior to Genesis 3. Even carnivores are capable of digesting different plants and procuring energy from them.
Death for plants proves existence of death.
You are making a category error here. Not only that, but animals are capable of eating a portion of a plant, while leaving the root in tact, so no, the plant does not necessarily die.
5) Human's energy source

What did Adam and Eve eat? What did die in order to provide humans with energy?
Fruit! It spells that out for us in Genesis 2.
6)Paradise

A place of bliss and content which could be only be result of Lord's presence which implies natural world wasn't blissfull and therefore potencially dangerous.
What happened to Adam if he had fallen of cliff?
Cliffs were the result of the Noahic flood. That is dealt with in the Hydroplate Theory, which you scoffed at.

At best for you, Lord did remove His anti-death protection for humans after eating apple.
He did forbid them eating from the Tree of Life and banished them from the Garden. There will be such a tree in the New Jerusalem, but I think you will need to repent and turn to the One True God whom Scripture declares to be omnipotent, if you wish to enjoy that fruit. BTW, repentant criminals will also be there to enjoy that fruit. The thief on the cross will also be there.
And for last, rest of Romans 6 isn't doing you much favour.

Let's consider verse 14:

For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace

Verse can be rewritten keeping same meaning:

For sin is your master, because you are under law, and not under grace.
No it cannot! We died to sin. Read verse 2. Read the whole chapter and don't just skim over it!

Logically, I have every NotA replaced with A and opposite.

So invoking law puts you automatically under sin which results in death which is exactly I don't want to be judged by Lord's law.
And we will all die, as I have already pointed out, unless that trumpet sound precedes what would otherwise be our ultimate fate.
 
We do. That's why we are called "BIBLICAL Families". It comes straight out of the BIBLE!
I do think you are so focused on Bible that you fail do to all Jesus instruction. See below regarding Pharisees.

Why? An industrial accident does not rise to the level of PREMEDITATED MURDER! Even in the Bible, if an axehead flew off and killed someone, God provided for cities of refuge!
What accident during manufacturing?

I'm have directly mentioned approval officer in FDA. You know, person confirming safety of medicine. Have you heard of crime by omission? When you don't do your duty.

Or maybe negligent homicide?

I consider such officer guilty of negligent mass murder.

No he is not! Overturning the death penalty led directly to him getting out, because of bleeding heart liberals, who have apparently gotten into your ear!
I don't see what that guy brings into this conversation.

No the misunderstanding is how you are trying to twist that verse of Scripture.
Answer question! Why sinner doesn't deserve death directly after doing sin?

You know, adultery rates would fall if both man and woman die from heart attack during intercourse.

So why our dear Lord doesn't do best adultery prevention program?

That is a term I am completely unfamiliar with.

Yet one of most important concept in common law. It's THE shield stopping inventing rules benefiting only inventor.

That is why Christ died on the cross sir. He took our punishment. You really need to spend some time reading some of the Pauline epistles!
So we are given mercy instead of punishment. Maybe you should too give some mercy?

Maybe instead of blindly following of Law, you should heed Master's warning:

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.

I don't know, about you, but I don't want to be like Pharisee. Totally knowledgeable about law, totally following law, totally deserving spanking.

Bad logic! The universe has always been upheld by its Creator God! Read Colossians chapter 1.
Look, did Lord create 2nd law of thermodynamics or not? If yes, from when?

I don't believe Lord has to do active maintenance of Universe. I don't doubt His engineering skills in creating permanent stuff.

No! The sin and disobedience directly led to death. You really need to study your Bible more. Paul lays it out for us in Rom 5, that death came into the world by sin.
I do need to read that chapter. But what death? Physically can't be since animals were created before plants and they had to eat something (for at least day).

Or maybe humans were somehow immortal before apple incident?

You have a small god who is incapable of holding the universe together. Your god is not the God of the Universe who created all things by the breath of His mouth.
Sound like you describing yourself.

In my experience, when choice is between two ideas of Lord, correct one is one more magnificient.

Literature for you:


Plants. There is no record of animals eating other animals prior to Genesis 3. Even carnivores are capable of digesting different plants and procuring energy from them.

You are making a category error here. Not only that, but animals are capable of eating a portion of a plant, while leaving the root in tact, so no, the plant does not necessarily die.

Fruit! It spells that out for us in Genesis 2.
So, what process eating starts? Digestion. What is digestion? Breaking big stuff into basic building blocks.

So digestion must kill plant cells.

So you claim there is no death, but somehow plant's fruit cells die.

Don't you Americans have saying math ain't mathing?
Cliffs were the result of the Noahic flood. That is dealt with in the Hydroplate Theory, which you scoffed at.
10 meter cliff is enough to kill a man. We don't need new theories for cliff.

Or you truly believe that on Earth during Garden times were exactly zero waterfalls? Or no rocks on sea-land border?
He did forbid them eating from the Tree of Life and banished them from the Garden. There will be such a tree in the New Jerusalem, but I think you will need to repent and turn to the One True God whom Scripture declares to be omnipotent, if you wish to enjoy that fruit. BTW, repentant criminals will also be there to enjoy that fruit. The thief on the cross will also be there.
Ooooh, calling me stupid has failed. Now I'm even heretic. I'm upgraded. 😇😇*

No it cannot! We died to sin. Read verse 2. Read the whole chapter and don't just skim over it!
I did. I'm just not persuaded. If normie Christianity has totally failed regarding marriage, maybe.....maybe, did they fail regarding other parts of Bible?

I know, hard idea.

And even short investigation what others think about Romans 6 will find out that some consider death physical and other spiritual (separation from God). So which is it?

You know,

*Sarcasm
 
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